I purchased 44000 Crowns myself.
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Crown is on sale! How much Crown have you purchased?
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Breakdown of speed bonuses?
Anyone have a good breakdown of the cap? Want to make sure I get the most of my builds.
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A counter criticism of 1vxers
zergs are bad, zergs this, zergs that....blah blah blah ;-)
Small group porponents (1vxer elitists!) who like to 1vx are just folks who can cheese (take advantage of mechanics) the best and dislike that NUMBERS > Abuse of Mechanics. In its own way, zerging has risen to counter the fact that 1 shield stacking, talon spamming, spear chucking, mass hysteria casting can beat 10 casual players.
Consider the progression;
Small group porponents (1vxer elitists!) who like to 1vx are just folks who can cheese (take advantage of mechanics) the best and dislike that NUMBERS > Abuse of Mechanics. In its own way, zerging has risen to counter the fact that 1 shield stacking, talon spamming, spear chucking, mass hysteria casting can beat 10 casual players.
Consider the progression;
- 1 guy running circles around a tree has got the attention of random casual player going to attack a castle.
- casual player peels from group to get murdered by the 1vxer.
- casaul player calls for help (it starts!)
- 1vxer wins again and continues to win until...
- the call for help reaches such proportion that the 1vxer is finally killed...
- And so mad that they come to the forums complaining about (insert skill here) and that it needs to be nerfed and zerglings are skill-less potatoes. (not realizing they were superior in skill and experience and mechanic knowledge in the first place...but its not enough, they need MORE power to dominate.)
-
well, whatcha think?
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Caption this photo 8/22
"Very crispy. Tan much?"
![4DHeKNL.jpg]()
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Lightning staff HA vs Inferno
Is there any particular reason, that fully charged Lightning heavy attacks restore about 1k more magicka than a fully charged Inferno heavy attack? Seeing it as it is, for a magicka build it is mandatory to use a heavy attack once per rotation to be able to sustain a fight with high DPS (NBs and DKs might have it a bit easier). @ZOS, why do you force us to use a lightning staff HA to sustain better, if we could also use an Inferno HA? Since channeled HAs are likely to cause a slow movement bug (solvable by either dodge rolling or another HA) it would be good to know, that there is no downside in using a different staff for HAs.
Not really complaining, but rather wanting to know why this is the case.
Not really complaining, but rather wanting to know why this is the case.
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Magicka DPS Set Bonus Comparison - MATH (pre-HotR)
The following calculations are for the purpose of comparing the Effective Spell Power of several Magicka armor sets in the Horns of the Reach update. This is not an exhaustive list, nor are the parameters cosidered the only ones relevant to how well a particular build performs.
Our primary concern is to quantify the cumulative benefit of the following bonuses on their respective sets: Max Magicka, Spell Damage, Crit Chance, Spell Penetration, and Additional Crit Damage. I will be using the UESP Effective Spell Power formula for these calculations, with all other variables removed. Crit % is determined by dividing the amount of crit by 219 (i.e. 1066 / 219 = 4.86 ~ 4.9).
The graphs below show how much more powerful each set is over a baseline with no set bonuses. Original calculations are at the bottom. The first graph is generated from adding all the values of the graphs Comparison A-G together, a sort of TLDR version.
UPDATE: Since the initial posting of this thread, Comparison G was added and included in the Cumulative Comparison, which switched the order of the bottom two sets, kicking Necropotence into last place.
![kmbi9a5710ot.jpeg]()
Individual Set Assessment:
1st Place - SPINNER'S
- Even with the 5th piece bonus being nerfed, this set is very strong assuming you are not already hitting the penetration cap. The nerf to Sharpened will make Spinner's an even more desirable set for making up the difference, and is one of the most efficient magicka damage sets for boosting Effective Spell Damage. This could potentially free up CP for use on other stars.
- Be mindful, however, that while the 2-4 piece bonuses will be universally beneficial, the 5th piece bonus will not have any effect on shields.
2nd Place - NETCH'S TOUCH
- The assumption here is that we are fully specced into lightning damage. If your parses show less than 75% total damage coming from lightning, you would be better off with Julianos. With 100% lightning damage, this set is very strong.
UPDATE:
Scathing Mage with an 80% uptime looks to be around here, almost as strong as fully specced Netch's Touch assuming you have the crit chance high enough to get 80% uptime. 60% would be equivalent to Julianos (naked).
3rd Place - JULIANOS (completing 5-1-1)
- One of the main benefits of Julianos is that, as a crafted set, it can come in Light, Medium, or Heavy. This allows us to craft pieces to complete a 5-1-1 setup, gaining an extra 2% more magicka over a 6-1 setup with 2 5-piece light armor sets.
UPDATE:
Silks of the Sun looks to be about here, assuming 100% fire damage.
4th Place - BURNING SPELL WEAVE
- The assumption here is that we have a 60% proc uptime. Below 57% would put the 5th piece bonus at the same level as Julianos' 5th piece. One thing that is not taken into account here is the additional Burning procs, which would boost Wall of Flame damage by 20%. BSW has the potential to be tied with Julianos for 3rd place, given the right conditions (66% uptime).
5th Place - JULIANOS (naked)
- Taking Julianos at face value, as if it were part of a 6-1 setup, without the extra 2% from the Undaunted passive, it still does well. It is worth noting that Julianos will be less optimized if running it as the only 5-piece set with 2 monster pieces as opposed to part or a double 5-piece set arrangement.
6th Place - MOTHER'S SORROW
- Although buffed significantly in HotR to 21% Crit, this set still falls short when examined in isolation. It does best in situations where you can boost Crit Damage high and generally get your other stats high as well. It essentially amplifies the base damage you do, becoming more powerful the stronger your other stats are. As we will see in the buffed set combinations graph, it moves to a BiS position given high enough stats in other areas.
7th Place - NECROPOTENCE
- Significantly hurt by the nerf to its 5th piece bonus, Necro is at the bottom of the pack. It still offers the most magicka compared to other sets, which will directly boost shields, pets, and provide more resources for casting, but it also requires an active pet and scales poorly with weapon attacks. It's difficult to quantify exactly how these factors should effect this set's position in Effective Spell Power ranking, being largely subjective how much each factor would be "worth" in a comparison like this.
I also compared what Necropotence would look like without any nerf. It would have come in 4th, edging out Burning Spell Weave. Personally, I think that would be the appropriate spot for it, and I would encourage the dev team to either fully revert the nerf or at least lessen it, perhaps to 3450, which is what Spinner's was nerfed to from 4000. @ZOS_GinaBruno
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In the graph below, 5000 points are removed from each calculated result to better highlight the differences between each.
![fl8xgmeqid8j.jpeg]()
Comparing Set Combinations with LOW stats:
Ranked from best to worst combinations:
Spinner/Netch
Spinner/Julianos
Spinner/BSW
Julianos/Netch
Spinner/Necro
Spinner/Mother
Netch/Necro
Julianos/BSW
Netch/Mother
Julianos/Necro
BSW/Necro
Julianos/Mother
BSW/Mother
Necro/Mother
These rankings line up closely with the individual rankings, which makes sense since in most calculation 4/5 of the variables were LOW stats, with only one being buffed to measure it's effect. Again, we see Necropotence and Mother's Sorrow near the bottom of the pack.
Now let's looks at these same set combinations when we buff all five of the calculated stats:
In the graph below, 10000 points are removed from each calculated result to better highlight the differences between each.
![j5cf5nn4ddxc.jpeg]()
Comparing Set Combinations with HIGH stats:
Ranked from best to worst combinations:
Spinner/Mother
Spinner/Julianos
Spinner/Netch
BSW/Mother
Julianos/Mother
Netch/Mother
Julianos/Netch
Spinner/BSW
Julianos/BSW
Spinner/Necro
Necro/Mother
Julianos/Necro
Netch/Necro
BSW/Necro
Here, we see Spinner's remain the top choice, while Mother's Sorrow comes catapulting to the front of the pack. Because these calculations were made with fully buffed stat figures, there is so much more raw power for Mother's Sorrow to amplify. We can also see that, Necropotence fairs the worst by a wide margin.
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The remaining graphs are simply a visual representation of the comparisons of each set's bonuses to a baseline. They don't really show much more new data, although it is interesting to see how some sets benefit more or less from certain stats being buffed.
UPDATE: A new chart, Comparison G has been added showing single set comparisons that are FULLY buffed.
![diocwbg3qden.jpeg]()
![mvyxzul69340.jpeg]()
![04xyitu1ts7d.jpeg]()
![e8yildjhqyur.jpeg]()
![f4531sgdsctx.jpeg]()
![bxb7v41shweg.jpeg]()
![fgqoo02dm5mz.jpeg]()
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And here we have the actual calculations that were used. Again, these values were plugged in to the UESP Build Editor "Effective Spell Power" Calculator, with the result given at the bottom of each.
1. Baseline A (all low values)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
4662
2. Baseline B (buffed Magicka +10k)
40k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5578
3. Baseline C (buffed SD +100)
30k Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5622
4. Baseline D (buffed Crit +20%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5051
5. Baseline E (buffed Pen +10%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5245
6. Baseline F (buffed Crit Dmg +20%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
4974
6. Baseline G (FULLY buffed)
40k Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
8703
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A Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5251 (589 over base)
B Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
46438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6166 (588 over base)
C Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6211 (589 over base)
D Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5689 (638 over base)
E Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5908 (663 over base)
F Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5602 (628 over base)
G Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
46438 Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9487 (784 over base)
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The following are calculations for Necropotence if it did not receive a nerf, but preserved its 4000 Magicka 5-piece bonus.
A Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5329 (667 over base)
B Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
47288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6244 (666 over base)
C Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6289 (667 over base)
D Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5773 (722 over base)
E Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5995 (750 over base)
F Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5684 (710 over base)
G Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
47288 Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9590 (887 over base)
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A Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5254 (592 over base)
B Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6206 (628 over base)
C Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6254 (632 over base)
D Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5675 (624 over base)
E Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5911 (666 over base)
F Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5254 (592 over base)
G Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9659 (956 over base)
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The following calculations add 2% Magicka to Julianos, since this is an added benefit of a Crafted set combined with a 5-light set and 1-piece monster piece to get 5-1-1.
A Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5314 (652 over base)
B Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41917 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6283 (705 over base)
C Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 3299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6313 (691 over base)
D Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5739 (688 over base)
E Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5978 (733 over base)
F Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5737 (763 over base)
G Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41917 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9763 (1060 over base)
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A Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5180 (518 over base)
B Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6174 (596 over base)
C Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6224 (602 over base)
D Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 81% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5578 (527 over base)
A Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5828 (583 over base)
F Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5665 (691 over base)
G Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3000 SD, 81% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9751 (1048 over base)
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A Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5417 (755 over base)
B Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
42192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6410 (832 over base)
C Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 3129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6460 (838 over base)
D Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 60% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5869 (818 over base)
E Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6041 (796 over base)
F Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5779 (805 over base)
G Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
42192 Magicka, 3129 SD, 60% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9834 (1131 over base)
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The following calculations assume 60% uptime. 66% uptime would give 31 more SD (2475). 57% uptime would remove 16 SD (2428). Uptimes lower than 57% are worse than the flat 299 SD from Julianos.
A Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5294 (587 over base)
B Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6226 (648 over base)
C Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6273 (651 over base)
D Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5726 (675 over base)
E Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5955 (710 over base)
F Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5681 (707 over base)
G Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9626 (923 over base)
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The following calculations assume 100% of skills used are Lightning-based damage. 90% would subtract 40 SD (2489). Every -5% = -20 SD. 75% would subtract 100 SD (2429), making it's 5th bonus essentially equal to Julianos.
A Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5377 (715 over base)
B Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6309 (731 over base)
C Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6356 (734 over base)
D Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5816 (765 over base)
E Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6049 (804 over base)
F Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5770 (796 over base)
G Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9737 (1034 over base)
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SET COMBINATIONS (Low Stats):
Spinner/Netch 3288 Magicka, 658 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2658 SD, 44.8% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6199
Spinner/Julianos 3288 + 2% Magicka, 428 SD, 9.7% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33953 Magicka, 2428 SD, 49.7% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6143
Spinner/BSW 3288 Magicka, 573 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2573 SD, 44.8% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6108
Spinner/Necro 8630 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
38630 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6057
Spinner/Mother 3288 Magicka, 129 SD, 21% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2129 SD, 61% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6009
Julianos/Netch 2192 + 2% Magicka, 828 SD, 14.4% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2828 SD, 54.4% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6060
Julianos/BSW 2192 + 2% Magicka, 743 SD, 14.4% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2743 SD, 54.4% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5974
Julianos/Necro 7534 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
38284 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5938
Julianos/Mother 2192 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 30.7% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2299 SD, 70.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5875
Netch/Necro 7534 Magicka, 529 SD, 4.8% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5977
Netch/Mother 2192 Magicka, 529 SD, 25.8% Crit
32192 Magicka, 2529 SD, 65.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5949
BSW/Necro 7534 Magicka, 444 SD, 4.8% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5894
BSW/Mother 2192 Magicka, 444 SD, 25.8% Crit
32192 Magicka, 2444 SD, 65.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5858
Necro/Mother 7534 Magicka, 21% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5820
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SET COMBINATIONS (Fully Buffed):
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Netch 3288 Magicka, 658 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3658 SD, 64.8% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10959
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Julianos 3288 + 2% Magicka, 428 SD, 9.7% Crit, 6.9% Pen
44153 Magicka, 3428 SD, 69.7% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
11005
Fully Buffed: Spinner/BSW 3288 Magicka, 573 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3573 SD, 64.8% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10840
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Necro 8630 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
48630 Magicka, 3129 SD, 60% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10677
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Mother 3288 Magicka, 129 SD, 21% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3129 SD, 81% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
11012
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Netch 2192 + 2% Magicka, 828 SD, 14.4% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3828 SD, 74.4% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10850
Fully Buffed: Julianos/BSW 2192 + 2% Magicka, 743 SD, 14.4% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3743 SD, 74.4% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10733
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Necro 7534 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
48484 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10602
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Mother 2192 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 30.7% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3299 SD, 90.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10886
Fully Buffed: Netch/Necro 7534 Magicka, 529 SD, 4.8% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10539
Fully Buffed: Netch/Mother 2192 Magicka, 529 SD, 25.8% Crit
42192 Magicka, 3529 SD, 85.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10872
Fully Buffed: BSW/Necro 7534 Magicka, 444 SD, 4.8% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10428
Fully Buffed: BSW/Mother 2192 Magicka, 444 SD, 25.8% Crit
42192 Magicka, 3444 SD, 85.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10887
Fully Buffed: Necro/Mother 7534 Magicka, 21% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3000 SD, 81% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10616
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Thanks for reading!
Also, please see my follow-up thread:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365915/necropotence-examination-more-math-pre-hotr#latest
Our primary concern is to quantify the cumulative benefit of the following bonuses on their respective sets: Max Magicka, Spell Damage, Crit Chance, Spell Penetration, and Additional Crit Damage. I will be using the UESP Effective Spell Power formula for these calculations, with all other variables removed. Crit % is determined by dividing the amount of crit by 219 (i.e. 1066 / 219 = 4.86 ~ 4.9).
The graphs below show how much more powerful each set is over a baseline with no set bonuses. Original calculations are at the bottom. The first graph is generated from adding all the values of the graphs Comparison A-G together, a sort of TLDR version.
UPDATE: Since the initial posting of this thread, Comparison G was added and included in the Cumulative Comparison, which switched the order of the bottom two sets, kicking Necropotence into last place.
Individual Set Assessment:
1st Place - SPINNER'S
- Even with the 5th piece bonus being nerfed, this set is very strong assuming you are not already hitting the penetration cap. The nerf to Sharpened will make Spinner's an even more desirable set for making up the difference, and is one of the most efficient magicka damage sets for boosting Effective Spell Damage. This could potentially free up CP for use on other stars.
- Be mindful, however, that while the 2-4 piece bonuses will be universally beneficial, the 5th piece bonus will not have any effect on shields.
2nd Place - NETCH'S TOUCH
- The assumption here is that we are fully specced into lightning damage. If your parses show less than 75% total damage coming from lightning, you would be better off with Julianos. With 100% lightning damage, this set is very strong.
UPDATE:
Scathing Mage with an 80% uptime looks to be around here, almost as strong as fully specced Netch's Touch assuming you have the crit chance high enough to get 80% uptime. 60% would be equivalent to Julianos (naked).
3rd Place - JULIANOS (completing 5-1-1)
- One of the main benefits of Julianos is that, as a crafted set, it can come in Light, Medium, or Heavy. This allows us to craft pieces to complete a 5-1-1 setup, gaining an extra 2% more magicka over a 6-1 setup with 2 5-piece light armor sets.
UPDATE:
Silks of the Sun looks to be about here, assuming 100% fire damage.
4th Place - BURNING SPELL WEAVE
- The assumption here is that we have a 60% proc uptime. Below 57% would put the 5th piece bonus at the same level as Julianos' 5th piece. One thing that is not taken into account here is the additional Burning procs, which would boost Wall of Flame damage by 20%. BSW has the potential to be tied with Julianos for 3rd place, given the right conditions (66% uptime).
5th Place - JULIANOS (naked)
- Taking Julianos at face value, as if it were part of a 6-1 setup, without the extra 2% from the Undaunted passive, it still does well. It is worth noting that Julianos will be less optimized if running it as the only 5-piece set with 2 monster pieces as opposed to part or a double 5-piece set arrangement.
6th Place - MOTHER'S SORROW
- Although buffed significantly in HotR to 21% Crit, this set still falls short when examined in isolation. It does best in situations where you can boost Crit Damage high and generally get your other stats high as well. It essentially amplifies the base damage you do, becoming more powerful the stronger your other stats are. As we will see in the buffed set combinations graph, it moves to a BiS position given high enough stats in other areas.
7th Place - NECROPOTENCE
- Significantly hurt by the nerf to its 5th piece bonus, Necro is at the bottom of the pack. It still offers the most magicka compared to other sets, which will directly boost shields, pets, and provide more resources for casting, but it also requires an active pet and scales poorly with weapon attacks. It's difficult to quantify exactly how these factors should effect this set's position in Effective Spell Power ranking, being largely subjective how much each factor would be "worth" in a comparison like this.
I also compared what Necropotence would look like without any nerf. It would have come in 4th, edging out Burning Spell Weave. Personally, I think that would be the appropriate spot for it, and I would encourage the dev team to either fully revert the nerf or at least lessen it, perhaps to 3450, which is what Spinner's was nerfed to from 4000. @ZOS_GinaBruno
----
In the graph below, 5000 points are removed from each calculated result to better highlight the differences between each.
Comparing Set Combinations with LOW stats:
Ranked from best to worst combinations:
Spinner/Netch
Spinner/Julianos
Spinner/BSW
Julianos/Netch
Spinner/Necro
Spinner/Mother
Netch/Necro
Julianos/BSW
Netch/Mother
Julianos/Necro
BSW/Necro
Julianos/Mother
BSW/Mother
Necro/Mother
These rankings line up closely with the individual rankings, which makes sense since in most calculation 4/5 of the variables were LOW stats, with only one being buffed to measure it's effect. Again, we see Necropotence and Mother's Sorrow near the bottom of the pack.
Now let's looks at these same set combinations when we buff all five of the calculated stats:
In the graph below, 10000 points are removed from each calculated result to better highlight the differences between each.
Comparing Set Combinations with HIGH stats:
Ranked from best to worst combinations:
Spinner/Mother
Spinner/Julianos
Spinner/Netch
BSW/Mother
Julianos/Mother
Netch/Mother
Julianos/Netch
Spinner/BSW
Julianos/BSW
Spinner/Necro
Necro/Mother
Julianos/Necro
Netch/Necro
BSW/Necro
Here, we see Spinner's remain the top choice, while Mother's Sorrow comes catapulting to the front of the pack. Because these calculations were made with fully buffed stat figures, there is so much more raw power for Mother's Sorrow to amplify. We can also see that, Necropotence fairs the worst by a wide margin.
----
The remaining graphs are simply a visual representation of the comparisons of each set's bonuses to a baseline. They don't really show much more new data, although it is interesting to see how some sets benefit more or less from certain stats being buffed.
UPDATE: A new chart, Comparison G has been added showing single set comparisons that are FULLY buffed.
----
And here we have the actual calculations that were used. Again, these values were plugged in to the UESP Build Editor "Effective Spell Power" Calculator, with the result given at the bottom of each.
1. Baseline A (all low values)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
4662
2. Baseline B (buffed Magicka +10k)
40k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5578
3. Baseline C (buffed SD +100)
30k Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5622
4. Baseline D (buffed Crit +20%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5051
5. Baseline E (buffed Pen +10%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5245
6. Baseline F (buffed Crit Dmg +20%)
30k Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
4974
6. Baseline G (FULLY buffed)
40k Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
8703
----
A Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5251 (589 over base)
B Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
46438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6166 (588 over base)
C Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6211 (589 over base)
D Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5689 (638 over base)
E Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5908 (663 over base)
F Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
36438 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5602 (628 over base)
G Necropotence (1096 x 3) + 3150 = 6438 Magicka
46438 Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9487 (784 over base)
----
The following are calculations for Necropotence if it did not receive a nerf, but preserved its 4000 Magicka 5-piece bonus.
A Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5329 (667 over base)
B Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
47288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6244 (666 over base)
C Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 3k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6289 (667 over base)
D Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 60% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5773 (722 over base)
E Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5995 (750 over base)
F Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
37288 Magicka, 2k SD, 40% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5684 (710 over base)
G Necropotence (no nerf) 7288 Magicka
47288 Magicka, 3k SD, 60% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9590 (887 over base)
----
A Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5254 (592 over base)
B Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6206 (628 over base)
C Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6254 (632 over base)
D Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5675 (624 over base)
E Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5911 (666 over base)
F Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5254 (592 over base)
G Julianos 1096 Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9659 (956 over base)
----
The following calculations add 2% Magicka to Julianos, since this is an added benefit of a Crafted set combined with a 5-light set and 1-piece monster piece to get 5-1-1.
A Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5314 (652 over base)
B Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41917 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6283 (705 over base)
C Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 3299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6313 (691 over base)
D Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5739 (688 over base)
E Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5978 (733 over base)
F Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
31717 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5737 (763 over base)
G Julianos 1096 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
41917 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9763 (1060 over base)
----
A Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5180 (518 over base)
B Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6174 (596 over base)
C Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6224 (602 over base)
D Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 81% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5578 (527 over base)
A Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5828 (583 over base)
F Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5665 (691 over base)
G Mother's Sorrow 1096 Magicka, 21% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3000 SD, 81% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9751 (1048 over base)
----
A Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5417 (755 over base)
B Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
42192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6410 (832 over base)
C Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 3129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6460 (838 over base)
D Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 60% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5869 (818 over base)
E Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6041 (796 over base)
F Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
32192 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5779 (805 over base)
G Spinner's 2192 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
42192 Magicka, 3129 SD, 60% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9834 (1131 over base)
----
The following calculations assume 60% uptime. 66% uptime would give 31 more SD (2475). 57% uptime would remove 16 SD (2428). Uptimes lower than 57% are worse than the flat 299 SD from Julianos.
A Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5294 (587 over base)
B Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6226 (648 over base)
C Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6273 (651 over base)
D Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5726 (675 over base)
E Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5955 (710 over base)
F Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5681 (707 over base)
G Burning Spell Weave 1096 Magicka, (525 x 0.6) + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9626 (923 over base)
----
The following calculations assume 100% of skills used are Lightning-based damage. 90% would subtract 40 SD (2489). Every -5% = -20 SD. 75% would subtract 100 SD (2429), making it's 5th bonus essentially equal to Julianos.
A Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5377 (715 over base)
B Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6309 (731 over base)
C Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 3529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6356 (734 over base)
D Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5816 (765 over base)
E Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6049 (804 over base)
F Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
31096 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
5770 (796 over base)
G Netch's Touch 1096 Magicka, 400 + 129 SD, 4.8% Crit
41096 Magicka, 3529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
9737 (1034 over base)
----
SET COMBINATIONS (Low Stats):
Spinner/Netch 3288 Magicka, 658 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2658 SD, 44.8% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6199
Spinner/Julianos 3288 + 2% Magicka, 428 SD, 9.7% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33953 Magicka, 2428 SD, 49.7% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6143
Spinner/BSW 3288 Magicka, 573 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2573 SD, 44.8% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6108
Spinner/Necro 8630 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
38630 Magicka, 2129 SD, 40% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6057
Spinner/Mother 3288 Magicka, 129 SD, 21% Crit, 6.9% Pen
33288 Magicka, 2129 SD, 61% Crit, 86.9% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6009
Julianos/Netch 2192 + 2% Magicka, 828 SD, 14.4% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2828 SD, 54.4% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
6060
Julianos/BSW 2192 + 2% Magicka, 743 SD, 14.4% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2743 SD, 54.4% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5974
Julianos/Necro 7534 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
38284 Magicka, 2299 SD, 49.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5938
Julianos/Mother 2192 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 30.7% Crit
32835 Magicka, 2299 SD, 70.7% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5875
Netch/Necro 7534 Magicka, 529 SD, 4.8% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2529 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5977
Netch/Mother 2192 Magicka, 529 SD, 25.8% Crit
32192 Magicka, 2529 SD, 65.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5949
BSW/Necro 7534 Magicka, 444 SD, 4.8% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2444 SD, 44.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5894
BSW/Mother 2192 Magicka, 444 SD, 25.8% Crit
32192 Magicka, 2444 SD, 65.8% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5858
Necro/Mother 7534 Magicka, 21% Crit
37534 Magicka, 2000 SD, 61% Crit, 80% Pen, 50% Crit Dmg
5820
----
SET COMBINATIONS (Fully Buffed):
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Netch 3288 Magicka, 658 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3658 SD, 64.8% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10959
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Julianos 3288 + 2% Magicka, 428 SD, 9.7% Crit, 6.9% Pen
44153 Magicka, 3428 SD, 69.7% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
11005
Fully Buffed: Spinner/BSW 3288 Magicka, 573 SD, 4.8% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3573 SD, 64.8% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10840
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Necro 8630 Magicka, 129 SD, 6.9% Pen
48630 Magicka, 3129 SD, 60% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10677
Fully Buffed: Spinner/Mother 3288 Magicka, 129 SD, 21% Crit, 6.9% Pen
43288 Magicka, 3129 SD, 81% Crit, 96.9% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
11012
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Netch 2192 + 2% Magicka, 828 SD, 14.4% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3828 SD, 74.4% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10850
Fully Buffed: Julianos/BSW 2192 + 2% Magicka, 743 SD, 14.4% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3743 SD, 74.4% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10733
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Necro 7534 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 9.7% Crit
48484 Magicka, 3299 SD, 69.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10602
Fully Buffed: Julianos/Mother 2192 + 2% Magicka, 299 SD, 30.7% Crit
43035 Magicka, 3299 SD, 90.7% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10886
Fully Buffed: Netch/Necro 7534 Magicka, 529 SD, 4.8% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3529 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10539
Fully Buffed: Netch/Mother 2192 Magicka, 529 SD, 25.8% Crit
42192 Magicka, 3529 SD, 85.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10872
Fully Buffed: BSW/Necro 7534 Magicka, 444 SD, 4.8% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3444 SD, 64.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10428
Fully Buffed: BSW/Mother 2192 Magicka, 444 SD, 25.8% Crit
42192 Magicka, 3444 SD, 85.8% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10887
Fully Buffed: Necro/Mother 7534 Magicka, 21% Crit
47534 Magicka, 3000 SD, 81% Crit, 90% Pen, 70% Crit Dmg
10616
----
Thanks for reading!
Also, please see my follow-up thread:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365915/necropotence-examination-more-math-pre-hotr#latest
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Allow Assigning House to d-pad quick links
Would really like to have my home easily accessible by D-pad assigning...
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Death Recap doesn't work
After the patch I've noticed that Death Recap screen became inactive (one can't view it). Some friends of mine have told that they're experiencing the same issue.
↧
What's your most triple *facepalm* moment of the day?
I'll start off, so I was just on my NB in Cyro picking off 3 players and one by one of them dead except for that last player. Mind you, it was super intense.
I almost ran out of resources and HP so I had to do my usual escape maneuver with cloaking and all that. As I rolled out of his direction and cloaked (almost got away), I was held back by some 'powerful snare' even after the snare immunity kicked in. Bewildered, I just cast Shuffle so as to remove the 'snare'. Didn't work, "WTF!" I thought to myself. No snare icon. No lags either.
So I cast another with hopes that it'll finally go away and that almost depleted my stam resource. To my surprise, I was still 'snared' and I was cursing at everything and by then, the Cloak timer is up and I was exposed, feeling naked and all with only enough magicka resource for one final Cloak while my stam regenerate.
Feeling desperate, I pressed the run/walk toggle in hopes that this might actually be the case.
Voila! Turns out the movement speed is back at the unhindered rate.... for a mere, God-forsaken ~1.5 seconds before the player found me to pin me down and let his proc damage set do all the finishing work. *cough* Selene *cough*
And there my inanimate, poor avatar was. Laying on the cold ground of war in Cyrodiil. Dead.
So I just sat here in my warm chair and speechless, triple facepalming the hell out of my head due to how clumsy I was accidentally toggling walking while in-combat. After 2-3 minutes of disbelieve, I went to the Control Settings and unbinded walking/run toggle once and for all and ragequit the game. *insert Angry German Kid video* Q.Q
/endofrant
Now that's out of the way, what's the most frustrating thing you've experienced in-game today? Or week if today's been blissful for you.
I almost ran out of resources and HP so I had to do my usual escape maneuver with cloaking and all that. As I rolled out of his direction and cloaked (almost got away), I was held back by some 'powerful snare' even after the snare immunity kicked in. Bewildered, I just cast Shuffle so as to remove the 'snare'. Didn't work, "WTF!" I thought to myself. No snare icon. No lags either.
So I cast another with hopes that it'll finally go away and that almost depleted my stam resource. To my surprise, I was still 'snared' and I was cursing at everything and by then, the Cloak timer is up and I was exposed, feeling naked and all with only enough magicka resource for one final Cloak while my stam regenerate.
Feeling desperate, I pressed the run/walk toggle in hopes that this might actually be the case.
Voila! Turns out the movement speed is back at the unhindered rate.... for a mere, God-forsaken ~1.5 seconds before the player found me to pin me down and let his proc damage set do all the finishing work. *cough* Selene *cough*
And there my inanimate, poor avatar was. Laying on the cold ground of war in Cyrodiil. Dead.
So I just sat here in my warm chair and speechless, triple facepalming the hell out of my head due to how clumsy I was accidentally toggling walking while in-combat. After 2-3 minutes of disbelieve, I went to the Control Settings and unbinded walking/run toggle once and for all and ragequit the game. *insert Angry German Kid video* Q.Q
/endofrant
Now that's out of the way, what's the most frustrating thing you've experienced in-game today? Or week if today's been blissful for you.
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↧
Overwhelming Surge and Elegant
I'm trying out a build I created using Overwhelming Surge, Elegant, and Stormfist on a Magsorc. I was wondering if Overwhelming Surge is any good or not? I know that julianos and necropotence are usually the go-to sets, but I wanted something different. Also I've never heard anyone talk about this set, so if anyone has any thoughts on it, thanks. Also, I'd be willing to switch from O.S. to something else, but not Juli, or Necro. Don't worry about the race or what weapons i'm using, I just want to know about the set.
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Linchol Grand Manor
When is that going to be available for purchase in game?
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Vvardenfell Furniture Plan Drop Rates
I am sure many of my fellow furniture crafting enthusiasts have experienced first-hand the frustration of obtaining Vvardenfell-only furnishing plans, especially the purple ones.
I have been recording data from my many Hleran Tomb clears. There are about 70 filled urns per clear. From June 5th to July 2nd I cleared Hleran Tomb 455 times, which is about 31,850 urns opened.
As of Update 14 we have several furniture plan loot tables:
Global: all the common, Breton, Redguard, Orc, Dark Elf, Nord, Argonian, High Elf, Wood Elf, and Khajiit plans
Vvardenfell: Ashlander, Dres, Hlaalu, Indoril, Redoran and Telvanni plans.
Dwarven: all the Dwarven plans
Daedric: all the Daedric plans
Special: plans that are obtainable from only one source. For example: the Wood Elf Throne, Vine plan from nobles in Grahtwood.
There aren't any problems with the Dwarven, Daedric and Special plan loot tables as they all have specific sources.
There is a problem with the Global and Vvardenfell plan tables. More specifically, the fact that Global plans are found in Vvardenfell way way too often.
In the 4 weeks of data I have collected so far I have looted the following plans:
45 White Global Plans
382 Green Global and 75 Green Vvard Plans (about 5 Global: 1 Vvard)
134 Blue Global and 22 Blue Vvard Plans (about 6 Global: 1 Vvard)
18 Purple Global and 4 Purple Vvard Plans (about 4.5 Global: 1 Vvard)
So, I loot ONE purple Vvardenfell-only plan once a week. There are 116 Vvardenfell-only purple plans (not sure if any fall into the Special source category or not). So, at my current loot rate it will take 116 weeks to loot them all (assuming you trade duplicates for unknown).
That is ridiculous!
I think there might be purple Vvardenfell plans that no one on the server has found yet!
What I think should be done to make this MUCH less frustrating for furniture crafters:
I know that ZoS needs to make money from players buying the Crown Store furniture and having the plans exceptionally rare will technically increase the revenue from Crown Furniture. There needs to be a balance though. Furniture mats are already rare and needed in large quantities for EACH piece of furniture. This means lots of time or gold needs to be invested. People will still buy Crown Furniture because they don't have the time or gold to craft it. You are only frustrating and angering furniture crafters and housing enthusiasts with the difficulty of looting Vvardenfell plans. I ask and my guildmates ask "Can anyone craft _____?" on a daily basis and the answer is almost always "No". It gets rather depressing.
There are Crown Exclusive furniture items already which people will buy. Perhaps to compliment their crafted furnishings...but what is the point of buying some Amber Jellyfish Lights if you have no furniture in your house and if you spend crowns on the craftable furniture then you don't have enough for the awesome Amber Jellyfish Lights:( Since nearly all players do not have unlimited money to spend on Crowns.
Thank you for taking the time to read this. Please seriously consider changing the current loot tables for Vvardenfell furniture plans.
Mix
I have been recording data from my many Hleran Tomb clears. There are about 70 filled urns per clear. From June 5th to July 2nd I cleared Hleran Tomb 455 times, which is about 31,850 urns opened.
As of Update 14 we have several furniture plan loot tables:
Global: all the common, Breton, Redguard, Orc, Dark Elf, Nord, Argonian, High Elf, Wood Elf, and Khajiit plans
Vvardenfell: Ashlander, Dres, Hlaalu, Indoril, Redoran and Telvanni plans.
Dwarven: all the Dwarven plans
Daedric: all the Daedric plans
Special: plans that are obtainable from only one source. For example: the Wood Elf Throne, Vine plan from nobles in Grahtwood.
There aren't any problems with the Dwarven, Daedric and Special plan loot tables as they all have specific sources.
There is a problem with the Global and Vvardenfell plan tables. More specifically, the fact that Global plans are found in Vvardenfell way way too often.
In the 4 weeks of data I have collected so far I have looted the following plans:
45 White Global Plans
382 Green Global and 75 Green Vvard Plans (about 5 Global: 1 Vvard)
134 Blue Global and 22 Blue Vvard Plans (about 6 Global: 1 Vvard)
18 Purple Global and 4 Purple Vvard Plans (about 4.5 Global: 1 Vvard)
So, I loot ONE purple Vvardenfell-only plan once a week. There are 116 Vvardenfell-only purple plans (not sure if any fall into the Special source category or not). So, at my current loot rate it will take 116 weeks to loot them all (assuming you trade duplicates for unknown).
That is ridiculous!
I think there might be purple Vvardenfell plans that no one on the server has found yet!
What I think should be done to make this MUCH less frustrating for furniture crafters:
- Remove the white global plans from the loot tables completely! These are available on npcs vendors and there is no need for them to also drop!
- Remove the Breton, Redguard, Orc, Dark Elf, Nord, Argonian, High Elf, Wood Elf and Khajiit plans from the Vvardenfell loot table. This leaves the common and Vvardenfell only plans in the overall plan loot table OR give the Vvardenfell plans a very large bias. As is for every 1 global plan I should loot 1 Vvardenfell plan.
- Add random furniture envelopes with Vvardenfell-only plans to the Master Writ vendor to give us an alternative to opening 1000's of urns to get our Vvardenfell plans.
I know that ZoS needs to make money from players buying the Crown Store furniture and having the plans exceptionally rare will technically increase the revenue from Crown Furniture. There needs to be a balance though. Furniture mats are already rare and needed in large quantities for EACH piece of furniture. This means lots of time or gold needs to be invested. People will still buy Crown Furniture because they don't have the time or gold to craft it. You are only frustrating and angering furniture crafters and housing enthusiasts with the difficulty of looting Vvardenfell plans. I ask and my guildmates ask "Can anyone craft _____?" on a daily basis and the answer is almost always "No". It gets rather depressing.
There are Crown Exclusive furniture items already which people will buy. Perhaps to compliment their crafted furnishings...but what is the point of buying some Amber Jellyfish Lights if you have no furniture in your house and if you spend crowns on the craftable furniture then you don't have enough for the awesome Amber Jellyfish Lights:( Since nearly all players do not have unlimited money to spend on Crowns.
Thank you for taking the time to read this. Please seriously consider changing the current loot tables for Vvardenfell furniture plans.
Mix
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Comparing Julianos pre-HotR to HotR LIVE (patch day 1)
The following calculations are derived from this thread: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/365915/necropotence-examination-more-math-pre-hotr#latest
Precise / Thief
Precise / Shadow
Sharpened / Apprentice, Mage, Shadow, Thief (Penetration Cap)
Sharpened / Apprentice, Lover, Mage, Shadow, Thief (5000 below Penetration Cap):
Takeaway message: The adjustment to Crit Bonuses on sets from 55% to 21% was a good move. That was indeed overperforming. BUT, also reducing the Shadow and Thief/Precise was unnecessary and ends up making them sub-par. If the Shadow and Thief/Precise would be restored to their 3.1.4 versions, the balance would be essentially PERFECT.
ZOS...please listen.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert
Precise / Thief
Julianos pre-HotR: 42352 Magicka, 2879 SD, 72.1% Crit, 67% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11095
Prepping HotR 3.1.4 Julianos calculation:
3 Magicka bonuses increased (1 from Julianos, 1 from monster, 1 from Moondancer)
967 x 3 = 2901
1096 x 3 = 3288
3288 - 2901 = 387
42352 ÷ 1.476 = 28693
28693 + 387 = 29080
29080 x 1.476 = 42922
42922 - 42352 = 570 more magicka for Julianos HotR than Julianos pre-HotR
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
1066 x 2 = 2132
2132 - 1376 = 756
756 / 219 = 3.45% more crit for Julianos HotR 3.1.4 than Julianos pre-HotR
Juliano HotR 3.1.4: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 75.5% Crit, 67% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11357 (2.36% better than pre-HotR)
Prepping HotR LIVE Julianos calculation:
Same magicka bonuses
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
833 x 2 = 1666
1666 - 1376 = 290
290 / 219 = 1.32% more crit for Julianos HotR LIVE than Julianos pre-HotR
3.45 - 1.32 = 2.13% less gained than 3.1.4
- 2% from Precise, -2% from Thief, -2.13% from set bonuses
75.5 - 6.13 = 69.37
Juliano HotR LIVE: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 69.3% Crit, 67% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11043 (0.47% worse than pre-HotR; 2.84% worse than 3.1.4)
So if you were running Precise/Thief before the patch, and would run Precise/Thief after the patch, there would be literally no difference in how Julianos performs now vs. then.
11095
Prepping HotR 3.1.4 Julianos calculation:
3 Magicka bonuses increased (1 from Julianos, 1 from monster, 1 from Moondancer)
967 x 3 = 2901
1096 x 3 = 3288
3288 - 2901 = 387
42352 ÷ 1.476 = 28693
28693 + 387 = 29080
29080 x 1.476 = 42922
42922 - 42352 = 570 more magicka for Julianos HotR than Julianos pre-HotR
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
1066 x 2 = 2132
2132 - 1376 = 756
756 / 219 = 3.45% more crit for Julianos HotR 3.1.4 than Julianos pre-HotR
Juliano HotR 3.1.4: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 75.5% Crit, 67% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11357 (2.36% better than pre-HotR)
Prepping HotR LIVE Julianos calculation:
Same magicka bonuses
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
833 x 2 = 1666
1666 - 1376 = 290
290 / 219 = 1.32% more crit for Julianos HotR LIVE than Julianos pre-HotR
3.45 - 1.32 = 2.13% less gained than 3.1.4
- 2% from Precise, -2% from Thief, -2.13% from set bonuses
75.5 - 6.13 = 69.37
Juliano HotR LIVE: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 69.3% Crit, 67% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11043 (0.47% worse than pre-HotR; 2.84% worse than 3.1.4)
So if you were running Precise/Thief before the patch, and would run Precise/Thief after the patch, there would be literally no difference in how Julianos performs now vs. then.
Precise / Shadow
18.3% Crit Dmg pre-HotR vs. 13.7% Crit Dmg HotR LIVE
Removing 11% Crit Chance for switching mundus stones
Julianos pre-HotR: 42352 Magicka, 2879 SD, 61.1% Crit, 85.3% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11383 (2.6% better than running Precise/Thief in pre-HotR
Prepping HotR 3.1.4 Julianos calculation:
3 Magicka bonuses increased (1 from Julianos, 1 from monster, 1 from Moondancer)
967 x 3 = 2901
1096 x 3 = 3288
3288 - 2901 = 387
42352 ÷ 1.476 = 28693
28693 + 387 = 29080
29080 x 1.476 = 42922
42922 - 42352 = 570 more magicka for Julianos HotR than Julianos pre-HotR
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
1066 x 2 = 2132
2132 - 1376 = 756
756 / 219 = 3.45% more crit for Julianos HotR 3.1.4 than Julianos pre-HotR
Juliano HotR 3.1.4: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 64.5% Crit, 85.3% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11691 (2.7% better than pre-HotR)
Prepping HotR LIVE Julianos calculation:
Same magicka bonuses
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
833 x 2 = 1666
1666 - 1376 = 290
290 / 219 = 1.32% more crit for Julianos HotR LIVE than Julianos pre-HotR
3.45 - 1.32 = 2.13% less gained than 3.1.4
- 2% from Precise, -2.13% from set bonuses
64.5 - 4.13 = 60.37
Juliano HotR LIVE: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 60.3% Crit, 80.7% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11212 (1.52% worse than pre-HotR)
11212 / 11043 = 1.53%
So while running Julianos with Precise / Shadow is 1.52% worse in HotR LIVE, it's still 1.53% better than running Julianos with Precise / Thief.
Removing 11% Crit Chance for switching mundus stones
Julianos pre-HotR: 42352 Magicka, 2879 SD, 61.1% Crit, 85.3% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11383 (2.6% better than running Precise/Thief in pre-HotR
Prepping HotR 3.1.4 Julianos calculation:
3 Magicka bonuses increased (1 from Julianos, 1 from monster, 1 from Moondancer)
967 x 3 = 2901
1096 x 3 = 3288
3288 - 2901 = 387
42352 ÷ 1.476 = 28693
28693 + 387 = 29080
29080 x 1.476 = 42922
42922 - 42352 = 570 more magicka for Julianos HotR than Julianos pre-HotR
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
1066 x 2 = 2132
2132 - 1376 = 756
756 / 219 = 3.45% more crit for Julianos HotR 3.1.4 than Julianos pre-HotR
Juliano HotR 3.1.4: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 64.5% Crit, 85.3% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11691 (2.7% better than pre-HotR)
Prepping HotR LIVE Julianos calculation:
Same magicka bonuses
2 Crit bonuses increased
688 x 2 = 1376
833 x 2 = 1666
1666 - 1376 = 290
290 / 219 = 1.32% more crit for Julianos HotR LIVE than Julianos pre-HotR
3.45 - 1.32 = 2.13% less gained than 3.1.4
- 2% from Precise, -2.13% from set bonuses
64.5 - 4.13 = 60.37
Juliano HotR LIVE: 42922 Magicka, 2879 SD, 60.3% Crit, 80.7% Crit Dmg, 12% CP Magic Done, 92% Pen, 5% Damage Done
11212 (1.52% worse than pre-HotR)
11212 / 11043 = 1.53%
So while running Julianos with Precise / Shadow is 1.52% worse in HotR LIVE, it's still 1.53% better than running Julianos with Precise / Thief.
Sharpened / Apprentice, Mage, Shadow, Thief (Penetration Cap)
These are the Effective Spell Power numbers for the build referenced above using Sharpened on HotR LIVE. I'll also include comparisons to how Thief and Sharpened would have looked if they had preserved their 3.1.4 values, but still only boosted crit set bonuses by 21%. We are assuming 2408 extra penetration from outside sources, not including Major Breach, to reach penetration cap (i.e. the old Sharpened value).
10000 points are subtracted from each value to better highlight their differences:
![Mundus_comparison.jpg]()
This seems like pretty strong proof that all they needed to do was tone down the 1-4 piece crit buffs and should have left the mundus stones as they were on the PTS.
10000 points are subtracted from each value to better highlight their differences:
This seems like pretty strong proof that all they needed to do was tone down the 1-4 piece crit buffs and should have left the mundus stones as they were on the PTS.
Sharpened / Apprentice, Lover, Mage, Shadow, Thief (5000 below Penetration Cap):
100 (Base Penetration) + 4884 (Light Armor) + 5280 (Major Breach) + 2752 (Sharpened) = 13016 + 4192 (Lover w/Divines) = 17208
18200 - 17208 = 992
So using Major Breach and Sharpened on a Light Armor character, you can only add 992 more Penetration (10 CP in Spell Erosion) before you begin over-penetrating.
We will be at 91.6% Penetration without Lover, and 100% with Lover (a difference of 8.4%)
All values will be lower here because 40 CP were removed from Spell Erosion but not added anywhere else. The relative strength is what we are concerned with.
Again, 10000 points are subtracted from each value:
![Comparing_Mundus_2.jpg]()
One thing to keep in mind: Gilliamtherogue has observed lower than expected values when adding Penetration in-game, especially closer to the pen cap. I'm still not totally sure why this anomaly exists, but suffice it to say, take the big lead from Lover here with a grain of salt. Also, remember that from an operational cost perspective, if you have all the pen buffs listed above, you miss out on taking advantage of cheap penetration gains from CP between points 11-50. You can put those points elsewhere, but they will accomplish less if placed into stars that are already near 50 points. If you are using a non-Sharp weapon or not applying Major Breach then the operational cost of using Lover is smaller and makes a good choice for consideration, particularly in solo play.
18200 - 17208 = 992
So using Major Breach and Sharpened on a Light Armor character, you can only add 992 more Penetration (10 CP in Spell Erosion) before you begin over-penetrating.
We will be at 91.6% Penetration without Lover, and 100% with Lover (a difference of 8.4%)
All values will be lower here because 40 CP were removed from Spell Erosion but not added anywhere else. The relative strength is what we are concerned with.
Again, 10000 points are subtracted from each value:
One thing to keep in mind: Gilliamtherogue has observed lower than expected values when adding Penetration in-game, especially closer to the pen cap. I'm still not totally sure why this anomaly exists, but suffice it to say, take the big lead from Lover here with a grain of salt. Also, remember that from an operational cost perspective, if you have all the pen buffs listed above, you miss out on taking advantage of cheap penetration gains from CP between points 11-50. You can put those points elsewhere, but they will accomplish less if placed into stars that are already near 50 points. If you are using a non-Sharp weapon or not applying Major Breach then the operational cost of using Lover is smaller and makes a good choice for consideration, particularly in solo play.
Takeaway message: The adjustment to Crit Bonuses on sets from 55% to 21% was a good move. That was indeed overperforming. BUT, also reducing the Shadow and Thief/Precise was unnecessary and ends up making them sub-par. If the Shadow and Thief/Precise would be restored to their 3.1.4 versions, the balance would be essentially PERFECT.
ZOS...please listen.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert
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Pvp and that stupid +5000 hp boost !
Dear Zos , why did you give the players flat +5000 hp in Cyro and duels ? If someone choose to invest all the resources in DAMAGE and run around with 10 k hp , let him doit , its his choise! Its not fair to give someone a bust of 50% hp , and to others just 10-15 %! If Im a tank , for me that 5000 hp its not big deal! I want you to change that and give the hp as a % of player actual Hp ! Good luck !
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Zos , why do you give in pvp +5000 hp ?
Dear Zos , why did you give the players flat +5000 hp in Cyro and duels ? If someone choose to invest all the resources in DAMAGE and run around with 10 k hp , let him doit , its his choise! Its not fair to give someone a bust of 50% hp , and to others just 10-15 %! If Im a tank , for me that 5000 hp its not big deal! I want you to change that and give the hp as a % of player actual Hp ! Good luck !
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PVP - Any plans on balancing heavy armor finally?
Heavy armor is grossly overpowered compared to medium. It sustains just as good thanks to the rapid mending resource bonus, it has access to shuffle like medium and it can provide you with a bunch of damage thanks to an array of offensive heavy armor sets.
Fighting some of these characters becomes impossible when they're dealing more damage than you, sustain better by abusing a resource mechanic and can take 3 times more punishment before going down.
If anyone over there cares about PVP balance, I propose the following;
- Consider tuning down offensive heavy armor sets, there should be no reason for me to run heavy armor and have more damage overall than in medium.
- Restrict armor actives to their armor tree, 5+ pieces required to use that active ability. No more shuffle on heavy armor, in fact, major evasion in heavy armor probably shouldn't be allowed at all.
- Remove the resource sustain from rapid mending, in what world does it make sense to wield a two handed massive weapon in FULL heavy armor and actually replenish your resources at an increased rate? If you were worried about pve tanks not sustaining as well, don't - they sustain perfectly fine in dungeons, and the ones that don't, need to work on their builds a bit.
If you want to see more balanced pvp gameplay in ESO, you really need to look into this heavy armor meta, it will only get worse in time.
Oh and btw since I'm here, get rid of those proc sets, no one asked for them, no one competent likes them, having your armor do damage for you is incredibly stupid. I never thought I'd say this, but I'm starting to miss the good old 1.5 pvp days too.
Have a good day.
Read the spoiler for more details:
Fighting some of these characters becomes impossible when they're dealing more damage than you, sustain better by abusing a resource mechanic and can take 3 times more punishment before going down.
If anyone over there cares about PVP balance, I propose the following;
- Consider tuning down offensive heavy armor sets, there should be no reason for me to run heavy armor and have more damage overall than in medium.
- Restrict armor actives to their armor tree, 5+ pieces required to use that active ability. No more shuffle on heavy armor, in fact, major evasion in heavy armor probably shouldn't be allowed at all.
- Remove the resource sustain from rapid mending, in what world does it make sense to wield a two handed massive weapon in FULL heavy armor and actually replenish your resources at an increased rate? If you were worried about pve tanks not sustaining as well, don't - they sustain perfectly fine in dungeons, and the ones that don't, need to work on their builds a bit.
If you want to see more balanced pvp gameplay in ESO, you really need to look into this heavy armor meta, it will only get worse in time.
Oh and btw since I'm here, get rid of those proc sets, no one asked for them, no one competent likes them, having your armor do damage for you is incredibly stupid. I never thought I'd say this, but I'm starting to miss the good old 1.5 pvp days too.
Have a good day.
Read the spoiler for more details:
DDuke: Mathematical facts? This should be fun.
Let's start with dodge roll. What's the problem with it?
Well, here's a list of basic skills that you cannot mitigate with dodge roll - they will hit you:
Puncturing Strikes (and morphs), Dive (and morphs), Radiant Destruction (and morphs), Dark Talons (and morphs), Petrify (and morphs), Aspect of Terror (and morphs), Daedric Curse (and morphs), Daedric Mines (and morphs), Lightning Form (and morphs), Spear Shards (and morphs), Backlash (and morphs), Scorch (and morphs), Impaling Shards (and morphs), Ash Cloud (and morphs), Wall of Elements (and morphs), Drain Essence (and morphs), Trap Beast (and morphs), Fire Rune (and morphs), Trapping Webs (and morphs), Caltrops (and morphs), Path of Darkness (and morphs), Agony (and morphs), Rune Prison (and morphs), Lightning Splash (and morphs), Volley (and morphs), Magicka Detonation (and morphs), Explosive Charge, Lotus Fan, Streak, Dark Flare (heal debuff portion only), Ritual of Retribution, Arctic Blast
And here's a list of skills that you can't mitigate with dodge once they've been applied:
Mages' Fury (and morphs), Sun Fire (and morphs), Eclipse (and morphs), Swarm (and morphs), Searing Strike (and morphs), Fiery Breath (and morphs), Cleave (and morphs), Twin Slashes (and morphs), Poison Arrow (and morphs), Arrow Spray (and morphs), Soul Trap (and morphs), Infectious Claws (and morphs)[Note: Infectious Claws is very, very difficult to dodge, but it's possible as per my tests], Entropy (and morphs), Volatile Armor
Bad huh? Gets worse:
Ultimates - Soul Strike (and morphs), Dawnbreaker (and morphs), Elemental Storm (and morphs), Meteor (and morphs), Dragonknight Standard (and morphs), Bat Swarm (and morphs), Consuming Darkness (and morphs), Soul Shred (and morphs), Summon Storm Atronach (and morphs), Negate Magic (and morphs), Radial Sweep (and morphs), Nova (and morphs), Sleet Storm (and morphs), Soul Harvest
And one ultimate which you can't mitigate by dodging once it has been applied: Lacerate (and morphs)
That's not all.
DW/2H Bleeds, Skoria proc, DoT set bonuses, lightning/resto heavy attacks - all undodgeable as well.
No matter how you put it, the vast majority of damage in the game is undodgeable. Worth noting though is that somewhat ironically stamina builds (apart from Warden & Templar) have the least amount of undodgeable attacks.
So based on this, we can lower any perceived practical value granted by medium armor's dodge roll cost reduction (20% with 5 medium). Not that it really matters, since the cost is stacking exponentially.
Just using the build I'm experimenting with atm (5 Hundings 5 Sheer Venom 2 Selene), here's an example of how many times I can dodge roll in a row (dodge roll cost 2585 with 56 points in Tumbling & 5 medium): 2585(+33%)->3438(+33%)->4573(+33%)->6081(+33%)->8088(+33%)->10 758
6 dodge rolls in a row and that's 35 523 stamina spent.
How about same setup in 5 heavy instead?
Dodge roll cost only goes up to 2973 as medium armor & CP modifiers are multiplicative.
2973(+33%)->3954(+33%)->5259(+33%)->6994(+33%)->9302(+33%)->12 372
So we "only" end up spending 5k more stamina dodging 6 times in a row, all things considered that's not a pretty big loss, especially when you no longer have to dodge roll the few dodgeable attacks left in this game thanks to higher mitigation.
...which brings us to the next portion. How much does the extra mitigation and healing received affect actual combat in PvP? Let's take a 100k tooltip Soul Assault as an example.
5/1/1 Full Legendary medium nets you 19% Spell Resistance
A 100K Soul Assault tooltip->28 571 damage/second, which gets halved to 14 286/second in PvP. We reduce 19% from that (let's assume there's equal amounts of penetration & armor buffs) and we get 11 572 damage/second on average.
Let's assume we're blocking (because what other option is there): -50% to that equals 5786 damage/second on average.
Now, my Vigor tooltip with 4461 weapon damage and 34 059 stamina is 14 997 over 5 seconds, which is halved in PvP (7499) - meaning 1500 health/second on average. We deduce that from the Soul Assault damage, and we'll "only" take 4286 damage from it through block.
Health Recovery (at 367 with 5 medium) also reduces another 642 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 3644 damage/second through block.
Now let's look at heavy armor.
Assuming the same setup (which isn't BiS for heavy, far from it), your Spell Resistance will be 24%, but your weapon damage will drop from 4461 to 4296.
14 286-24%->10 857-50%(block)=5429 damage/second
Now Vigor. With 4296 weapon damage, Vigor has a tooltip of 14 676. The healing received gets increased by 8% from Rapid Mending, so you get 15 850 health over 5 seconds. Halved in PvP & divided by five, we get to 1585 health/second on average.
5429-1585=3844
Health Recovery (at 417 with 5 heavy) also reduces another 730 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 3114 damage/second through block.
So heavy armor is able to mitigate 15.6851% more damage on average than medium armor after you count in Vigor & health recovery (Rally and any other self heal would further widen the gap).
However, the real difference comes with the sets available to heavy & medium:
Legion+Fury for example will net you a Vigor tooltip of 16029(+8%)->17 311, or 1731 health/second on average (+some small heals from Legion) - this leads to Soul Assault dealing an average 3698 damage/second.
Health Recovery (at 587 with 5 heavy & a set bonus from Legion) also reduces another 1027 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 2671 damage/second through block.
30.8155% difference to what a medium setup that goes all in for high heals/dmg (at the cost of sustain) would give you.
Speaking of sustain, let's compare those next:
With the medium setup, I have 1391 Stamina Recovery & 1091 Magicka Recovery.
With the same buffs & CPs, Legion+Fury heavy armor build (with the same monster set) gets you 1257 Stamina Recovery (a 10% difference) & 1091 Magicka Recovery. However, with 5 heavy Constitution can be considered equal to 270 Stamina/Magicka Recovery, so in fact you get more stamina & magicka recovery in a heavy armor build (1527 "stamina regen" & 1361 "magicka regen") than you do in medium, unless you get multiple set bonuses from gear (in which case if you're medium, you're giving up damage/healing for sustain and thus further widening difference seen above between damage mitigated/outhealed).
Surprise Attack in 5/1/1 Heavy costs you 2250 stamina
Surprise Attack in 5/1/1 Medium costs you 2066 stamina
A difference of 184 stamina.
Assuming you manage to spam Surprise Attack once every 1,3s (weave time with GCD) with no downtime, you'd need 313 stamina regen to get even, which is covered by Constitution alone in the comparison I made above, so you don't even need cost reduction or regen on jewelry to get even.
So yeah, just some little maths detailing why heavy armor is significantly stronger at the moment. I believe that if dodge roll was a more reliable defense, the cost reduction on that with medium could be used as an argument.
But even so, the amount of times you can dodge doesn't really differ (see above), so I do think medium needs significant buffs to get on par with heavy.
Let's start with dodge roll. What's the problem with it?
Well, here's a list of basic skills that you cannot mitigate with dodge roll - they will hit you:
Puncturing Strikes (and morphs), Dive (and morphs), Radiant Destruction (and morphs), Dark Talons (and morphs), Petrify (and morphs), Aspect of Terror (and morphs), Daedric Curse (and morphs), Daedric Mines (and morphs), Lightning Form (and morphs), Spear Shards (and morphs), Backlash (and morphs), Scorch (and morphs), Impaling Shards (and morphs), Ash Cloud (and morphs), Wall of Elements (and morphs), Drain Essence (and morphs), Trap Beast (and morphs), Fire Rune (and morphs), Trapping Webs (and morphs), Caltrops (and morphs), Path of Darkness (and morphs), Agony (and morphs), Rune Prison (and morphs), Lightning Splash (and morphs), Volley (and morphs), Magicka Detonation (and morphs), Explosive Charge, Lotus Fan, Streak, Dark Flare (heal debuff portion only), Ritual of Retribution, Arctic Blast
And here's a list of skills that you can't mitigate with dodge once they've been applied:
Mages' Fury (and morphs), Sun Fire (and morphs), Eclipse (and morphs), Swarm (and morphs), Searing Strike (and morphs), Fiery Breath (and morphs), Cleave (and morphs), Twin Slashes (and morphs), Poison Arrow (and morphs), Arrow Spray (and morphs), Soul Trap (and morphs), Infectious Claws (and morphs)[Note: Infectious Claws is very, very difficult to dodge, but it's possible as per my tests], Entropy (and morphs), Volatile Armor
Bad huh? Gets worse:
Ultimates - Soul Strike (and morphs), Dawnbreaker (and morphs), Elemental Storm (and morphs), Meteor (and morphs), Dragonknight Standard (and morphs), Bat Swarm (and morphs), Consuming Darkness (and morphs), Soul Shred (and morphs), Summon Storm Atronach (and morphs), Negate Magic (and morphs), Radial Sweep (and morphs), Nova (and morphs), Sleet Storm (and morphs), Soul Harvest
And one ultimate which you can't mitigate by dodging once it has been applied: Lacerate (and morphs)
That's not all.
DW/2H Bleeds, Skoria proc, DoT set bonuses, lightning/resto heavy attacks - all undodgeable as well.
No matter how you put it, the vast majority of damage in the game is undodgeable. Worth noting though is that somewhat ironically stamina builds (apart from Warden & Templar) have the least amount of undodgeable attacks.
So based on this, we can lower any perceived practical value granted by medium armor's dodge roll cost reduction (20% with 5 medium). Not that it really matters, since the cost is stacking exponentially.
Just using the build I'm experimenting with atm (5 Hundings 5 Sheer Venom 2 Selene), here's an example of how many times I can dodge roll in a row (dodge roll cost 2585 with 56 points in Tumbling & 5 medium): 2585(+33%)->3438(+33%)->4573(+33%)->6081(+33%)->8088(+33%)->10 758
6 dodge rolls in a row and that's 35 523 stamina spent.
How about same setup in 5 heavy instead?
Dodge roll cost only goes up to 2973 as medium armor & CP modifiers are multiplicative.
2973(+33%)->3954(+33%)->5259(+33%)->6994(+33%)->9302(+33%)->12 372
So we "only" end up spending 5k more stamina dodging 6 times in a row, all things considered that's not a pretty big loss, especially when you no longer have to dodge roll the few dodgeable attacks left in this game thanks to higher mitigation.
...which brings us to the next portion. How much does the extra mitigation and healing received affect actual combat in PvP? Let's take a 100k tooltip Soul Assault as an example.
5/1/1 Full Legendary medium nets you 19% Spell Resistance
A 100K Soul Assault tooltip->28 571 damage/second, which gets halved to 14 286/second in PvP. We reduce 19% from that (let's assume there's equal amounts of penetration & armor buffs) and we get 11 572 damage/second on average.
Let's assume we're blocking (because what other option is there): -50% to that equals 5786 damage/second on average.
Now, my Vigor tooltip with 4461 weapon damage and 34 059 stamina is 14 997 over 5 seconds, which is halved in PvP (7499) - meaning 1500 health/second on average. We deduce that from the Soul Assault damage, and we'll "only" take 4286 damage from it through block.
Health Recovery (at 367 with 5 medium) also reduces another 642 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 3644 damage/second through block.
Now let's look at heavy armor.
Assuming the same setup (which isn't BiS for heavy, far from it), your Spell Resistance will be 24%, but your weapon damage will drop from 4461 to 4296.
14 286-24%->10 857-50%(block)=5429 damage/second
Now Vigor. With 4296 weapon damage, Vigor has a tooltip of 14 676. The healing received gets increased by 8% from Rapid Mending, so you get 15 850 health over 5 seconds. Halved in PvP & divided by five, we get to 1585 health/second on average.
5429-1585=3844
Health Recovery (at 417 with 5 heavy) also reduces another 730 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 3114 damage/second through block.
So heavy armor is able to mitigate 15.6851% more damage on average than medium armor after you count in Vigor & health recovery (Rally and any other self heal would further widen the gap).
However, the real difference comes with the sets available to heavy & medium:
Legion+Fury for example will net you a Vigor tooltip of 16029(+8%)->17 311, or 1731 health/second on average (+some small heals from Legion) - this leads to Soul Assault dealing an average 3698 damage/second.
Health Recovery (at 587 with 5 heavy & a set bonus from Legion) also reduces another 1027 from the damage taken, so you end up taking 2671 damage/second through block.
30.8155% difference to what a medium setup that goes all in for high heals/dmg (at the cost of sustain) would give you.
Speaking of sustain, let's compare those next:
With the medium setup, I have 1391 Stamina Recovery & 1091 Magicka Recovery.
With the same buffs & CPs, Legion+Fury heavy armor build (with the same monster set) gets you 1257 Stamina Recovery (a 10% difference) & 1091 Magicka Recovery. However, with 5 heavy Constitution can be considered equal to 270 Stamina/Magicka Recovery, so in fact you get more stamina & magicka recovery in a heavy armor build (1527 "stamina regen" & 1361 "magicka regen") than you do in medium, unless you get multiple set bonuses from gear (in which case if you're medium, you're giving up damage/healing for sustain and thus further widening difference seen above between damage mitigated/outhealed).
Surprise Attack in 5/1/1 Heavy costs you 2250 stamina
Surprise Attack in 5/1/1 Medium costs you 2066 stamina
A difference of 184 stamina.
Assuming you manage to spam Surprise Attack once every 1,3s (weave time with GCD) with no downtime, you'd need 313 stamina regen to get even, which is covered by Constitution alone in the comparison I made above, so you don't even need cost reduction or regen on jewelry to get even.
So yeah, just some little maths detailing why heavy armor is significantly stronger at the moment. I believe that if dodge roll was a more reliable defense, the cost reduction on that with medium could be used as an argument.
But even so, the amount of times you can dodge doesn't really differ (see above), so I do think medium needs significant buffs to get on par with heavy.
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Should ESO have a bounty hunting system? (PvP)
Personally I feel that ESO lacks unpredictability in most of it's repeatable activities, so do you think that this could be a fun thing that could happen every now and then?
(Maybe it could work on a system where if you gain a high enough bounty then other players with a certain perk will be able to see you, or it could function completely differently)
(Maybe it could work on a system where if you gain a high enough bounty then other players with a certain perk will be able to see you, or it could function completely differently)
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Cyrodiil and duel Hp buff !
Dear Zos , why did you give the players flat +5000 hp in Cyro and duels ? If someone choose to invest all the resources in DAMAGE and run around with 10 k hp , let him doit , its his choise! Its not fair to give someone a bust of 50% hp , and to others just 10-15 %! If Im a tank , for me that 5000 hp its not big deal! I want you to change that and give the hp as a % of player actual Hp ! Good luck !
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[Community Project] SET BONUS THINK-TANK
Hello and welcome to the ESO Set Bonus Think-Tank, an ongoing community project to offer interesting and creative ideas to the dev team for 5-piece and monster 2-piece gear sets!
The rational behind this project is twofold. First, more heads are better than one (or however many devs work on set bonus ideas). Sure, some suggestions may not end up being feasible, but we also might get some great ones that could eventually find their way into the game. Second, complaining about too many proc sets is easy, but if you want to see some interesting non-proc sets in the game, put some thought into making a suggestion of your own. Let's work proactively to show the dev team the kind of set bonuses we would like to see instead of just being negative.
Please follow these guidelines when posting:
1. Only ONE set bonus suggestion per post! You do not need to speficy whether the set bonus would be for a 5-piece or 2-piece set, nor indicate other 1-4 piece bonuses, but you may if you wish. You can make multiple posts back to back, but we need each idea to be seperate because...
2. Use the![<3]( "<3")
AWESOME reaction to indicate your interest in someone's idea. Think of this like Upvoting. It should help the devs easily see which set bonus ideas garner significant attention.
3. Although a contributor may include numberic values in their set bonus suggestion, please consider all numbers as "subject to change." I would rather not get hung up on complaints about suggested values being too OP or too weak. The values can simply act as a rough estimate or, if you are submitting an idea, you can just use [X] if you prefer.
4. There are no restrictions to the kinds of mechanics a set bonus can have. If you have an idea for a set, whether it procs off of something or not, feel free to post it. ALL IDEAS ARE WELCOME!
I hope we can get some good ideas and thoughtful discussion here that will be helpful to the dev team and healthy for the game.
@ZOS_GinaBruno
So...ready, set, THINK!
UPDATE: TOP RATED IDEAS (10 or more "Awesomes")
- When a food buff is active, you gain 2000 magicka and 150 magicka regen.
- All speed increase, reduce sprint cost
The rational behind this project is twofold. First, more heads are better than one (or however many devs work on set bonus ideas). Sure, some suggestions may not end up being feasible, but we also might get some great ones that could eventually find their way into the game. Second, complaining about too many proc sets is easy, but if you want to see some interesting non-proc sets in the game, put some thought into making a suggestion of your own. Let's work proactively to show the dev team the kind of set bonuses we would like to see instead of just being negative.
Please follow these guidelines when posting:
1. Only ONE set bonus suggestion per post! You do not need to speficy whether the set bonus would be for a 5-piece or 2-piece set, nor indicate other 1-4 piece bonuses, but you may if you wish. You can make multiple posts back to back, but we need each idea to be seperate because...
2. Use the
AWESOME reaction to indicate your interest in someone's idea. Think of this like Upvoting. It should help the devs easily see which set bonus ideas garner significant attention.3. Although a contributor may include numberic values in their set bonus suggestion, please consider all numbers as "subject to change." I would rather not get hung up on complaints about suggested values being too OP or too weak. The values can simply act as a rough estimate or, if you are submitting an idea, you can just use [X] if you prefer.
4. There are no restrictions to the kinds of mechanics a set bonus can have. If you have an idea for a set, whether it procs off of something or not, feel free to post it. ALL IDEAS ARE WELCOME!
I hope we can get some good ideas and thoughtful discussion here that will be helpful to the dev team and healthy for the game.
@ZOS_GinaBruno
So...ready, set, THINK!
UPDATE: TOP RATED IDEAS (10 or more "Awesomes")
- When a food buff is active, you gain 2000 magicka and 150 magicka regen.
- All speed increase, reduce sprint cost
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Started new character
As title said, started new char, Dunmer, i dont want to do vvardenfell but then i dont particularly want to quest in EP either ( find most zones upto Eastmarch dreary n boring if u wondering)
Err aye the point of this, can i take boat from vvardenfell an just start questing for any faction?
Err aye the point of this, can i take boat from vvardenfell an just start questing for any faction?
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